並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep04-%E8%AE%80%E4%BC%81%E7%AE%A1%E7%B3%BB%E7%9A%84%E6%88%91%E6%98%AF%E5%85%A8%E7%8F%AD%E5%94%AF%E4%B8%80%E4%B8%80%E5%80%8B%E9%9D%9E%E7%87%9F%E5%88%A9%E7%B5%84%E7%B9%94%E5%B7%A5%E4%BD%9C%E8%80%85/id1633965253?i=1000576104929