並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep136-%E6%AD%A1%E8%BF%8E%E9%AB%92%E8%A9%B1%E6%9C%80%E5%A4%9A%E7%9A%84%E9%8B%BC%E7%90%B4%E8%80%81%E5%B8%AB-%E8%A9%B1%E5%A4%9A%E5%88%B0%E4%B8%80%E9%9B%86%E8%81%8A%E4%B8%8D%E5%AE%8C-feat-%E6%B1%9F%E8%80%81%E5%B8%AB/id1482088693?i=1000569464966